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Prolife or Prochoice; which are you for?
Topic Started: Dec 6 2006, 11:56 AM (1,138 Views)
UnNegi-relatedname
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I had no implication that just because it was me. I'm saying that if I were anyone, I have the right to get an abortion.
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Rark
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aigu92,Apr 15 2008
02:06 AM
@Rark: I think I have the right to decide that I'm going to murder my English teacher. Izzat so simple?

Yep, it really is. You can go right ahead and do anything you want, as long as you're prepared for the consequences. Also, under the proper circumstances, it would be allowed, and even encouraged to do so. Self-defense, times of war, and the like. Much like with abortion, there are circumstances where aborting a fetus would be proper. Rape, physical inability to carry a baby, inability to care for a baby, etc. The bearer of the fetus should have the right to abort it, should it be needed.

And I don't want to see people say anything along the lines of "Abortion is easy/selfish/get out of baby free card." It's a very important decision for the child bearer as it causes tremendous stress on the uterus and woman. In some cases, abortion can be the most humane thing to do for a child. Being born into an unready home, facing possible abuse/witness to it, living in poverty, going hungry, and all those other neat fun negative things that tend to come about in society.

In conclusion, I feel that abortion should be a liable option for women no matter what, it is they who have not only the choice, but the consequences on their shoulders, and you people that call it murder, isn't helping them in the least. A raped woman gets an abortion, and people call it murder, FUCK THAT! As if that poor woman doesn't have enough problems, that burden is placed on her too.

What a cruel paradox pro-life is.
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UnNegi-relatedname
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And technically, it doesn't count as a life until it is about 2 months old.
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Rark
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It's not even a life, the fetus is just some twisted half-life that pro-life activist have a hyper obsession over. Okay, so they love and want the thing to be born when the woman goes to abort it, but when it's say three years old, the father has abandoned the mother and she's having a hard time doing anything, they're "We don't want OUR tax dollars to help out some poor bitch" It's not like there's some Nearly Aborted child group, where get help/food/support from these self-righteous people that wanted them born to begin with. Until I see that, will I even consider pro-life arguments valid reasonable.
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aigu92
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Rark,Apr 26 2008
04:07 PM
Yep, it really is. You can go right ahead and do anything you want, as long as you're prepared for the consequences. Also, under the proper circumstances, it would be allowed, and even encouraged to do so. Self-defense, times of war, and the like. Much like with abortion, there are circumstances where aborting a fetus would be proper. Rape, physical inability to carry a baby, inability to care for a baby, etc. The bearer of the fetus should have the right to abort it, should it be needed.

And I don't want to see people say anything along the lines of "Abortion is easy/selfish/get out of baby free card." It's a very important decision for the child bearer as it causes tremendous stress on the uterus and woman. In some cases, abortion can be the most humane thing to do for a child. Being born into an unready home, facing possible abuse/witness to it, living in poverty, going hungry, and all those other neat fun negative things that tend to come about in society.

In conclusion, I feel that abortion should be a liable option for women no matter what, it is they who have not only the choice, but the consequences on their shoulders, and you people that call it murder, isn't helping them in the least. A raped woman gets an abortion, and people call it murder, FUCK THAT! As if that poor woman doesn't have enough problems, that burden is placed on her too.

What a cruel paradox pro-life is.

I don't believe that rape is a reason to kill a baby. I mean, if you think about it, what does it matter who the father is? A baby's still a life. It doesn't matter if it's technically not a life yet, because it has the possibility of being a life. To me, a eight-month-old fetus is not much different than a month-old baby. That logic is scientific, but you can't narrow life down to science. It's too important. You can't say when a person is really a person scientifically. A life is not a subject to have it's worth be measured scientifically.

And, personally, I would rather be born into a house with abuse and negative feelings than never live at all. It's the human instinct of survival, in a way. And even if your life is horrible during your childhood, you'll have a chance to break free from that when you grow up.
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UnNegi-relatedname
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LIKE I FRIGGIN SAID BEFORE, IF THE FETUS IS MORE THAN 3 MONTHS OLD, IT IS ILLEGAL TO ABORT IT.
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Regalar
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I personally see no difference between an abortion and taking a pistol and blowing your child's brain apart. Why is it that a fetus is not a human being and yet a 6 month old child is? As for the rape, unability to care for it etc...so how about this. I cannot care for my 6 year old. I have no money, no way of getting enough to support both myself and this child. Do I have the right to gun the kid down and toss it in a ditch somewhere? People have no bizzare notion that because it is as of yet unborn it is somehow less...alive....than that sweet little 6 year old.
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´Silas
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Regalar,May 8 2008
08:10 AM
I personally see no difference between an abortion and taking a pistol and blowing your child's brain apart. Why is it that a fetus is not a human being and yet a 6 month old child is? As for the rape, unability to care for it etc...so how about this. I cannot care for my 6 year old. I have no money, no way of getting enough to support both myself and this child. Do I have the right to gun the kid down and toss it in a ditch somewhere? People have no bizzare notion that because it is as of yet unborn it is somehow less...alive....than that sweet little 6 year old.

Truth has been spoken, ye ye, hear it
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Asakura Raine
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Regalar,May 8 2008
11:10 PM
I personally see no difference between an abortion and taking a pistol and blowing your child's brain apart. Why is it that a fetus is not a human being and yet a 6 month old child is? As for the rape, unability to care for it etc...so how about this. I cannot care for my 6 year old. I have no money, no way of getting enough to support both myself and this child. Do I have the right to gun the kid down and toss it in a ditch somewhere? People have no bizzare notion that because it is as of yet unborn it is somehow less...alive....than that sweet little 6 year old.

How about sparing that 6 year old kid 6 years of pain and suffering instead via abortion?

You must be fucking twisted to bring a child into a world where it won't receive adequate care in the first place.
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´Silas
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Asakura Raine,May 8 2008
09:52 AM
How about sparing that 6 year old kid 6 years of pain and suffering instead via abortion?

You must be fucking twisted to bring a child into a world where it won't receive adequate care in the first place.

How can it possible be counted as fair, to have someone else dictate whether you're gonna have a good or bad life, and more so, decide based on that, whether you should live or not. I read today in the newspaper that there's an increase in late abortions, due to the fact that there's a scan that can tell whether the child is gonna have mental disabilities or not. Put another way, people are apparently deciding that someone should not be allowed to live, or they'd probably say something along the lines "suffer", and therefore they decide to kill it :O I think I'll just grab my rifle and start deliberating some poor existances with Down's syndrome.

side note: I have a cousin with Down's syndrome, so don't even go there.
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UnNegi-relatedname
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My argument is not "Abortion is justified if the kid is retarded". My argument here is that abortion is justified by the freedom of choice.

And don't give me "Oh you can have a freedom to kill."

It's legal BECAUSE it's the freedom of choice.
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Regalar
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There is no such guaranteed freedom as "freedom of choice".
I do not have the freedom to kill you, so what makes a child any different from yourself?

EDIT: And I agree, you must be twisted to pureposefully have sex when you know sex brings about a child and yet you cannot care for that child. But I don't see why the child must be the one to suffer for their parents choices...
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UnNegi-relatedname
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This is the last time I'm saying this. A fetus (THE THING YOU ABORT.) is in no way a child. WHAT MAKES a fetus different from me, and any other human being, is that WE CAN FEEL. WE CAN THINK. WE CAN FUNCTION. A fetus is not a child, until it can do all three of the above listed. Only then, will abortion be compared to as killing another human being.


But abortion is not suffering. Because a fetus feels no pain until a certain age. So you'd rather let the child exist in the world, suffering and struggling for life, than simply not bring the child into the world at all.
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Asakura Raine
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´Silas,May 9 2008
12:59 AM
Asakura Raine,May 8 2008
09:52 AM
How about sparing that 6 year old kid 6 years of pain and suffering instead via abortion?

You must be fucking twisted to bring a child into a world where it won't receive adequate care in the first place.

How can it possible be counted as fair, to have someone else dictate whether you're gonna have a good or bad life, and more so, decide based on that, whether you should live or not. I read today in the newspaper that there's an increase in late abortions, due to the fact that there's a scan that can tell whether the child is gonna have mental disabilities or not. Put another way, people are apparently deciding that someone should not be allowed to live, or they'd probably say something along the lines "suffer", and therefore they decide to kill it :O I think I'll just grab my rifle and start deliberating some poor existances with Down's syndrome.

side note: I have a cousin with Down's syndrome, so don't even go there.

I'm pretty sure that the anyone should be able to see if your child is going to suffer. It's not as if you're going to have the birth and some rich aristocrat will just come out of the blue and shout your kid a new life. Some families can handle disabilities - and they are willing to look after it. Conversely, some families cannot even tolerate the concept of having a mentally impaired child, so they have the right to abort. You may say "So pretty much, you can kill them if they are retarded", but look deeper than that - beyond the disability. You need a very, very careful and patient guardians to look after someone like that and if you aren't, the child will suffer. Tremendously.

How do your Uncle and Aunty look after your cousin? Do they lock him in his room? Do they beat him for making too much noise? Obviously not. I'm pretty sure they are respectable enough to face up to the challenge of having a disabled child. However, some people actually do beat the child for making too much noise and lock him/her in his/her room. Do you think this is a fair way to treat the child? Believe me, some parents think this is an adequate way to handle their child.

That being said, I think of having a child as a rite; as a privilege. You can't just have a child, you have to want a child. And until the parents realise this, it is deplorable to even consider having a baby. There are times when accidents occur - and abortion is an answer to those accidents. I don't believe people ever go "Look, I don't have a job, house, car or clothes, but I do have a sperm. So why waste it?" That is bullshit. No one ever purposefully goes out and creates a child they do not want.

I hate all these gun references and shooting babies. God, it's a pathetic way to describe what abortion is about. You do not shoot people because you care and because you think that they will be better off. You shoot people out of hatred and malice. Abortion is done because you care and because you think they would be better off - no malice or bad feelings. Immediately, you are framing abortion as some barbaric act. You think the nurse just walks in with a plastic bag and a coathanger?

@Unnegi: Even if the fetus does feel pain, it's nothing a little anesthesia can't fix. With abortions, because we don't really know if a fetus feels pain, it is mandatory to ask the mother if she would like to use anesthesia on the baby before aborting.
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UnNegi-relatedname
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We do know if a fetus can feel pain. A fetus does not have any veins until it reaches a certain age. Therefore, it cannot feel anything.
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