Something to ponder on.

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Something to ponder on.; First min Rly in the UK? and oldest still operating
Topic Started: 3 May 2009, 09:17 PM (1,029 Views)
Cagney boy	3 May 2009, 09:17 PM Post #1
Operations Manager Posts: 679 Group: Member Member #291 Joined: October 21, 2007	I just had a thought, What started the miniature railways in this country and where was the first miniature railway in the country?
	Laurence Michael Smith Every night is a MRW Skype night!, add me on Skype and let the converstion grow!


DevilDrummer	3 May 2009, 09:46 PM Post #2
Director Posts: 2,054 Group: Member Member #300 Joined: November 2, 2007	There is no miniature railways in Britaint, it is all just a figment of your imagination.
	"Humans are so smart, they dont even need a meteorite to destroy themselves, like the stupid dinosaurs did!" http://devildrummertom.fotopic.net


DGH	3 May 2009, 10:39 PM Post #3
Operations Manager Posts: 727 Group: MRMT Trustees Member #30 Joined: August 23, 2006	A search on Google 'first miniature railway in britain' comes up with http://www.ardkinglas.com/estategardenrailway.php David



john new	4 May 2009, 12:50 PM Post #4
Porter Posts: 47 Group: Member Member #332 Joined: November 25, 2007	Can we extend this to oldest still operating? My memory is telling me that when we went there for an SLS event two or three years ago the Downs School Railway. although not the first to be built, claims to be the oldest still operating. It is a bit like the SLS, we are celebrating our centenary this year, as far as we are aware we are the oldest railway enthusiast society (as opposed to a railway professionals society) but know we were not the first to be founded. However those that were older than us by founding date, to the best of our knowledge, now folded. As an extension of this topic - what is the oldest still working miniature steam locomotive? Our Orion must be amongst the oldest. See http://www.stephensonloco.org.uk/sls_orion.htm Edited by john new, 4 May 2009, 12:51 PM.
	John V Chair & Webmaster Wessex Assoc' Mod' Rly' Clubs. http://www.wamrc-railway-modellers.org.uk/ \| Web & Publicity Officer for Stephenson Locomotive Soc. - http://www.stephensonloco.org.uk \| York Model Rly Show - http://www.yorkshow.org.uk \| Waggonway Research Circle http://www.waggonways.fsnet.co.uk


Cagney boy	4 May 2009, 07:53 PM Post #5
Operations Manager Posts: 679 Group: Member Member #291 Joined: October 21, 2007	I know the oldest still operating 15" gauge railway is the Rhyl Miniature Railway.....But thats all I know.
	Laurence Michael Smith Every night is a MRW Skype night!, add me on Skype and let the converstion grow!


romulus	4 May 2009, 11:15 PM Post #6
Ticket Collector Posts: 58 Group: Member Member #704 Joined: April 30, 2008	Does the Duke of Westminsters not count. john



craiggluyas	5 May 2009, 07:57 AM Post #7
Director Posts: 2,277 Group: MRMT Trustees Member #46 Joined: October 5, 2006	Well, both were lifted then relaid, so one could argue that neither is the oldest.... Oldest continuous 15" gauge and probably any gauge would be Lakeside, which has operated since 25th May 1911. Rhyl was of course opened first (1st May 1911) but was lifted in 1969/70 before being relaid in 1977/78. Craig
	Craig Gluyas Talking to one's self is a sign of madness. I talk to my imaginary friend.


colinpeake	5 May 2009, 08:23 AM Post #8
MRW Digest Editor Posts: 1,659 Group: MRMT Trustees Member #6 Joined: August 15, 2006	romulus 4 May 2009, 11:15 PM Does the Duke of Westminsters not count. john The railway DGH has linked to, although 18" gauge, pre-dates the Heywood lines by several years, but was certainly 'miniature' in concept. Colin
	Colin Peake MRW Digest Editor Miniature Railways - Colin Peake's Photos


Badger064ST	5 May 2009, 10:20 AM Post #9
Driver Posts: 253 Group: MRMT Trustees Member #44 Joined: September 29, 2006	One of the earliest miniature lines and 15 inch gauge was the railway that belonged to Charles Fildes at Far Sawrey in Windermere. The locomotive that worked this 300 yard railway was a 2-2-2 called Lavinia. This dated from around 1850 and used a launch type boiler. Local legend claims the railway was used to collect firewood during the winter months this was because during the sumer Lavinia's boiler was used in Fildes paddle steamer Fairey Queen. An early locomotive that requires more research is Edina a Stephenson style 2-2-2 that lives at the National Musuem of Scotland, this loco dates from the 1840s and was presented to a professor Forbes by his pupils the Longridges who were early loco builders. There is archival evidence the loco was steamed but there is little known of what sort of railway it was used on however the curators know the loco was steamed as the boiler, firebox, blast pipe and smokebox show evidence of very old soot!
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greatwesternng	6 May 2009, 07:49 PM Post #10
Porter Posts: 25 Group: Member Member #312 Joined: November 9, 2007	A year or so ago, and on another Forum, the following appeared: "Mark Smithers in "Sir Arthur Heywood and the Fifteen Inch Gauge Railway" documents that the likely candidate for the first private estate railway, predating that at Ardkinglas in Scotland, was a railway built by Robert Rodney in the grounds of his house at Old Alresford in Hampshire c.1843. > As I am currently living less than 5 minutes walk from Old Alresford House, indeed today I was in the graveyard of the local parish church looking at the graves of the Rodney family, I thought I would try and investigate what appears to be a pioneer railway, and one that was potentially a major influence of Heywood's own activities at Duffield Bank, and later at Eaton Hall. At this point I have little more to go on than that published in the aforementioned book by Mark Smithers, and some local knowledge, so would be very interested to hear from anyone that has additional information or potential sources of such that will aid my local research." Having lived, been bought up and schooled within a stone's throw of Alresford, I was able to suggest a couple of avenues of research. I didn't hear more. But knowing the area, the Alresford valley is renown for its watercress beds, an intricate network of shallow 'lagoons', fed by the River Itchen, which have traditionally been serviced by primitive railways. At first, these were simple groves in stone, but later became rail based systems of the sort we would know with plate-type turntables allowing the trolleys to make right-angled turns down between the 'lagoons'. Knowing Alresford House, and of the Rodney family, it is entirely possible (although I hasten to say complete speculation on my part) that they could have developed an early estate railway as a means of moving their Watercress. Does anyone know more? Will



romulus	6 May 2009, 09:25 PM Post #11
Ticket Collector Posts: 58 Group: Member Member #704 Joined: April 30, 2008	I agree with all that is written above but when I mentioned the Duke of westminsters I was thinking of the oldest line still working today. As an aside has there ever been a definitive answer as to what happened to the original "Effie". was she definitely taken to dove leys as rumoured? It would be great to solve this problem and you never know she may be hiding somewhere. John



chris krupa	10 May 2009, 03:45 PM Post #12
Porter Posts: 23 Group: Member Member #56 Joined: October 27, 2006	Is there not a 15 inch gauge locomotive built by Peter Brotherhood in one of the London colleges? I don't think that it has ever been steamed but it surely should be included in the annals of the earliest steam locomotives. Chris



DGH	10 May 2009, 07:43 PM Post #13
Operations Manager Posts: 727 Group: MRMT Trustees Member #30 Joined: August 23, 2006	chris krupa 10 May 2009, 03:45 PM Is there not a 15 inch gauge locomotive built by Peter Brotherhood in one of the London colleges? I don't think that it has ever been steamed but it surely should be included in the annals of the earliest steam locomotives. Chris Yes See http://www.gn15.info/notes-on-the-early-history-of-15-inch-gauge-prototypes/ Also on here is some other interesting facts re 15" gauge David



Timbo	11 May 2009, 10:28 PM Post #14
Timbo Posts: 1,367 Group: Moderators Member #53 Joined: October 24, 2006	There was quite a bit of discussion about "Pearl" which is located at the Uni just down the road at Aldwych, on the landing of a back staircase in the depths of the buildings - somewhere on these boards before. "Search" function isn't working on Zetaboards at the mo (not our fault!) but I seem to remember that it made a visit to the RHDR for a gala a few years back. Here are some photos I took in KCL for this forum:
	Tim Dunn MRW Moderator www.bekonscot.com www.meteorite.co.uk


woody	12 May 2009, 09:30 AM Post #15
Ticket Collector Posts: 62 Group: Member Member #86 Joined: January 10, 2007	first public line as such i would of thought was a savages built tunnel railway? Edited by woody, 12 May 2009, 09:32 AM.


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