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The Chestnut Street Transitway; This one is for the old heads
Topic Started: Aug 23 2007, 06:40 PM (2,035 Views)
Neoei3318
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Walking along Chestnut St. yesterday, random memories flashed in my head about the Chestnut Street Transitway. I believed it was discontined in 95 (Before I left Philly) Due to idiot motorists and the fact that it was a misguided idea.

I also remembered when I had a 42 schedule form that era and RTS buses running Westbound up Chestnut St.

Anyways, here are some questions.

When & why was it formed?

Was the 2 way routing part of the deal?

When was it abandoned?

Last but not least, Good idea or bad idea?
(Market St. would've been my choice).

Discuss, Discuss...
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TRANSIT_FREAK
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i think you mean the trolley tracks .

the trolley tracks were not abandoned they were shutdown for some time septa promised they would bring back the trolleys but never came


sorry that is all i know
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Septa3371CSX1
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Septa3371CSX1
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The Chestnut Street Transitway was opened I believe in the 1970's after Chestnut Street closed to traffic from 18th to 6th. I think the idea was to have a street exclusive to buses in Center City. Yes, it did have a two way routing. In fact, one of the alternate routings on the westbound Route 9 is regular route to 7th and Walnut, R-7th, L-Chestnut Street, L-17th Street, R-Walnut regular route. I believe all of the Chestnut Street routes still have this in their official route tarriff even though it can't be used anymore. It was, however, an ill-conceived idea. Businesses started complaining about how delivery vehicles couldn't get to their stores. They also said that people who drive to Center City wouldn't be able to find where they were. So in 1999 the city abandoned the transitway and reconfigured Chestnut Street back into a one-way eastbound street between 18th and 6th Streets.

There was nothing about trolley tracks involved in this whole thing. The transitway in my opinion was a bad idea. This concept NEVER works in a central business district. There is too much activity in these areas to make a street a busway. Market Street would not have been a good idea either.
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Mark
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Neoei3318
Aug 23 2007, 11:40 PM
Walking along Chestnut St. yesterday, random memories flashed in my head about the Chestnut Street Transitway. I believed it was discontined in 95 (Before I left Philly) Due to idiot motorists and the fact that it was a misguided idea.

I also remembered when I had a 42 schedule form that era and RTS buses running Westbound up Chestnut St.

Anyways, here are some questions.

When & why was it formed?

Was the 2 way routing part of the deal?

When was it abandoned?

Last but not least, Good idea or bad idea?
(Market St. would've been my choice).

Discuss, Discuss...

1]When & why was it formed?

The transitway was a long-standing plan for urban renewal on Chestnut St. The original plan was to run a European trolley-like tram shuttle on the street. The tram idea was dropped and a busway was what they settled on. It was built as part of some minor upgrades the City made to make Center City more attractive for the 1976 Bicentennial. Construrction began in the winter of 1975 and finished in the fall of the same year. The remarkable thing about this was the reconstruction was done ON TIME AND ON BUDGET, a shocking rarity for projects in this city.

2]Was the 2 way routing part of the deal?

Yes. Route 42 was routed both ways [between 7th and 17th Sts] onto the Transitway as soon as the transitway was finished. Route 38 began running both ways in 1976. Route D [21] ran eastbound-only. Route 9 [EB only]joined in 1980.
Around 1981-82 some NJ Transit buses were routed on the transitway they were the D[Changed to the 404 in '82], P[406],9[419], and 9a[409]. In '85, the Mid-City Loop was changed to the 76, and it stayed that way until the line was restructured into the BenFrankline in 1990. The NJT lines were put back on Market in 1987, the 42 west went back to Walnut in the early 90's, and the 38 west was routed onto Market at the same time.

3]When was it abandoned?

!n 1999. Buisiness on Chestnut St declined rapidly, with a lot of empty storefronts
and many of the surviving businesses complaining about the lack of traffic, parking, and an inability to get deliveries.

4]Last but not least, Good idea or bad idea?
(Market St. would've been my choice).


Bad Idea. If the transitway was on Market St, the same fate would have befallen Market. The late 80's reconstruction of Market St did wonders for business on the Street, so the City decided to do the same for Chestnut St. The City had to wait until the Feds said it was OK to remove the transitway since it was originally built with Federal Funds.
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Septa3371CSX1
Aug 24 2007, 07:06 PM
The Chestnut Street Transitway was opened I believe in the 1970's after Chestnut Street closed to traffic from 18th to 6th. I think the idea was to have a street exclusive to buses in Center City. Yes, it did have a two way routing. In fact, one of the alternate routings on the westbound Route 9 is regular route to 7th and Walnut, R-7th, L-Chestnut Street, L-17th Street, R-Walnut regular route. I believe all of the Chestnut Street routes still have this in their official route tarriff even though it can't be used anymore. It was, however, an ill-conceived idea. Businesses started complaining about how delivery vehicles couldn't get to their stores. They also said that people who drive to Center City wouldn't be able to find where they were. So in 1999 the city abandoned the transitway and reconfigured Chestnut Street back into a one-way eastbound street between 18th and 6th Streets.

There was nothing about trolley tracks involved in this whole thing. The transitway in my opinion was a bad idea. This concept NEVER works in a central business district. There is too much activity in these areas to make a street a busway. Market Street would not have been a good idea either.

Minneapolis...Nicollet Mall.

It works very well there as a place where only buses, taxis, and bicycles could go. In fact, one summer, they diverted all bus traffic to nearby Hennepin Avenue so that the restaurant goers could enjoy peace while eating outdoors without having to worry about bus engines whooshing right next to them. I don't know if they decided to do that again, although I know there were surveying riders about it.

Are there any pictures of the Philadelphia transitway? What "construction" took place to make it that way? I guess the failing of this project was due to the fact that there weren't sufficient alleyways for trucks and that it was more hidden than other streets?

I guess it's basically the fact that Philadelphia is much busier than other cities, such as Minneapolis.
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Neoei3318
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Thank you very much for your replies. I found a plaque in the sidewalk at Broad & Chestnut (Borders side), "Chestnut Street Transitway," Dedicated 1975, Frank L. Rizzo, Mayor (or soomething to that effect). "
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