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2010 Season; Combined Competition
Topic Started: Jan 4 2010, 06:44 PM (37,367 Views)
Highlander
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come on guys no names we dont want the forum shut down again!!!
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galahs
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Highlander
Apr 28 2010, 09:22 PM
come on guys no names we dont want the forum shut down again!!!
:correct:
As much as everyone has the right to free speech, we want to be careful atm. We can't afford another legal issue atm.
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dilly
Harold Matthews
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If the Oakdale situation is true it is a real shame. The Oakdale club is the only club in the combined competition that does not have any juniors. The point system is designed so that clubs are encouraged to use their juniors. The Oakdale club are in a unique position in regards to this points system and when it was designed the Oakdale club's situation was obviously overlooked in the criterea of the points system. One would have to think it may be even seen to be discriminatory towards the Oakdale club. Every other club in the combined competition has the choice of whether of not they use their juniors. The Oakdale club has no choice. Where are they supposed to get their players from?

If other clubs reap the benefit of Oakdale's misfortune, it is doubtful that they would want to receive points under these circumstances. If the Oakdale club remains in this untenable situation, it is obvious that this will contribute to their demise within Group 6. One would have to wonder. Other clubs in Group 6 would not want this to happen.
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Highlander
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Mate Bowral dont have many Jnrs(4 teams none of which are full) and it really hurts not having those players coming through the ranks topping up snrs as the jnrs they do have are forced to other clubs or eaten up by the private schools for there rugby squads so ive always admired Oakdale putting 2 teams in the top grade each year and it would be a ashame for them to loose there points.

But rules are rules weather we like them or not.

If clubs are on the demise it would be nice for the NRL/CRL to try and assist these clubs before its to late.
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DevelopmentCoach
Harold Matthews
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Honestly I'm not surprised this has come up. The problem with these blanket points systems is that they expect a black and white outcome to everything. It clearly didn't take into account this situation of a club without a strong junior base. Just as the points system didn't take into account the different club and player landscape in Campbelltown/Liverpool versus Group 6.

I admire that they what they are trying to achieve, but blanket solutions aren't the case when there are so many different stakeholders invovled
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disco stu
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I feel sorry for Oakdale but in the big scheme of things they seriously need to look at how to remain sustainable long term if they dont have juniors coming thru.Their senior players are also running the club as the committee , so things are tough at the moment for them. There playing roster hasnt changed alot over the years so it amazes me they have gone over. A club can have as many points as they like but can only use the max 300 points when fielding their teams on gamedays. Regradless of their situation rules are rules , if you give one team an inch the rest will take a mile.
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dilly
Harold Matthews
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Highlander I am not denying there are problems in the southern end of Group 6, they have been there festering for a while now, it has been put in the "too hard basket".

My comments are purely and simply directed at the problems at hand with the Oakdale club and I will stipulate that I am not associated with the Oakdale club. I am a supporter of Group 6 and Country Rugby League. The following comments are not directed to your post Highlander and are not directed toward any one in particular.

I agree rules are rules, but the rules have to be fair and incorporate all club situations and not just the majority or some. If rules exclude all scenarios how can they be fair across the board.

The Group 6 clubs were assured over and over again that there would not be any concessions made to the Campbelltown clubs in regards to the Point System. Just prior to the comp starting the Campbelltown clubs were given the concession of any player registered with their club in 2009 and if that player went back to that same club in 2010 they would be deemed a 2 point player. The reason given for this concession was because they could not make it retrospective.

My argument is that this Point System should have been finalised at the end of last season prior to any clubs signing up players for 2010, then those concessions given to the Campbelltown clubs would not have been necessary and when those concessions were made it should have been given to all clubs in the Combined Competition, not just the Campbelltown clubs. Group 6 clubs played in a combined competition last year under a points system when the Campbelltown clubs did not. This season the Campbelltown clubs are given concessions of the above nature when Group 6 clubs still have players carrying points for the stipulated 3 years. Not fair.

Yet Oakdale who have no juniors are given no real concessions at all for their situation. Not fair.

Rules are rules but only when they are fair. Unfortunately to me the rules look a bit "helter skelter"and rushed and are not looking at the big picture and all concerned.

Of course these are only my personal opinions and last time I looked we were living in Australia where the "fair go" was a big part of the Aussie culture.
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tc6_11
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You are right, the Oakdale playing roster has barely changed. The first grade roster this season has decreased, at Present the following first graders from last year have either not played or are not playing
Tom Moon (40), Peter Lett (40), Geoff Thomson (40), Rick Trevithick (25), Matt McBeth (2), Clint Mason (2), Ben Fryer (2)
As you can see Oakdale have shed massive points this year.
Where Oakdale are being penalised is obtaining 5 players from within the Group, namely 3 Picton juniors. These boys all play in the Oakdale reserve grade team, and 3 of these boys did not play football last year, for one reason or another. Oakdale's Reserve Grade are 1 from 5, and have been wearing some considerable hidings in their outings.
It is an absolute must for a club to field a reserve grade team in order to field a sucessful First Grade. If Oakdale were to cull these boys, among other 25 point players, where would their future lie?
It has been a black and white decision handed down by the management, that did not consider the extraordinary circumstance that Oakdale are in. It is not as though Oakdale have tried to cheat the system.
Oakdale is a very proud club, without great success.
2010: 5wins from 5games
2009: 3rd
2008: 2nd
2007: 4th
2006: 3rd
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Highlander
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Dilly Im with you mate!!!

The Merger was designed to assit the Wests district rebuild its senior comp and has done that with flying colors thats great for them and for rubgy league. BUT has it done the same for group 6 clubs?????

Until there is one committe i cant see the problems going away anytime soon.

As Dilly said these are only my opinions.
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disco stu
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Welcome to the forum tc6_11, you obviously have some first hand knowledge on the situation with the Oakdale club and thanks for sharing this with the members here on this forum. I think we are now better informed of what has happened.

I posted the oakdale situation not to create any controversy but to make the forum members aware of what happened .At the end of the day the name of the club would have been known eventually so there was no use playing charades . Regardless of what happenes from here i'll guess we'll have to leave it between the club and group management to sort out. With some constructive comments here hopefully the management types who read this forum will take onboard the data, the forum users have presented. :clap:
Edited by disco stu, Apr 29 2010, 01:56 PM.
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Camden-nite
Harold Matthews
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how do group six determine the value placed on a player, attached is an example of another groups value of players
MWJRFL Points System 2010
VALLEY UNITED
SURNAME CHRISTIAN NAME POINTS REASON
Belford Matthew (-) 5 Local Valley United Junior
Blaker Brett (+) 15 Played North Sydney NSW Cup 2009
Clayton Tim (+) 10 Played Wentworthville Jim Beam Cup 2009
Cox David (+) 0 Played with Valley United for one year
Daff Chris (+) 0 Played with Valley United for two years
Dalton Sean (+) 15 Played North Sydney NSW Cup 2009
Faets Casey (+) 0 Transferred from Narraweena 2009
Ferris Jason (+) 5 Transferred from Gundagai in 2010
Fuller Michael (-) 5 Local Valley United Junior
Gearin Bryce (-) 5 Local Valley United Junior
Gearin Jake (+) 0 Played with Valley United for three years
Jones-Wiegold Jai (+) 5 Transfer from Nth Curl Curl junior club
Montgomery Dylan (+) 0 Played with Valley United for two years
Moore Shane (-) 5 Local Valley United Junior
Sankey Ryan (-) 5 Local Valley United Junior
Saunders Adam (-) 5 Local Valley United Junior
Smith Ben (+) 0 Transferred from Forestville in 2008
Stevens Hayden (-) 5 Local Valley United Junior
Wilson Todd (+) 5 Transfer from Christian Bros junior club


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tc6_11
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Oakdale can only hope that all the constructive things they put forward one day get considered
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Maverick
Apr 26 2010, 09:28 AM
GROUP 6 WESTERNSUBURBS 2010 1ST GRADE REP SQUAD
Players Name Club

Gavin Willson.........Narellan
Matthew Eckler .....Picton
Salamona Fainifo...C'town City
Josh champion.......Moss Vale
Robert Carter........Mittagong
Adam shepherd.....Thirlmere
Kyal Shepherd.......Picton
Tod Black .............Narellan
Brad Goodwin........C'town City
Alex Peters............Picton
Matthew Carloyn...Thirlmere
Nick Crouche..........Oakdale
Rob Wyae..............Moss Vale
Dellamont .............Moss Vale
Jaden Merchant.....Thirlmere
Michael stevens.....East C'town
Dean watson.........C'town City
Elliopt Esquanant...Moss Vale
Pat Gibson..............The oaks
Pellay......................East C'town
David Lowe.............Oakdale
Willy McDonnald .....Moss Vale
Jacob Morgan..........East C'town
Hi, congrates to those that made the train on squad, but at least get the names correct one glaring error is moss vale player Elliott Esquilant.anyone see any others. Go group six. :winner:
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Lecky
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In my thoughts players should be graded depending on what there previous years playing experience and ability has been. It is ridiculous that potentially a representative first grade player transfering to another club is worth the same points as a bench player for reserve grade if he was to transfer. Somewhere common sense should play apart. Oakdale has been a long standing and reputable club in group 6 and having watched them this year it is evident they are of a similar quality team as what they have been for the last couple of years and cant believe they would have exceeded the points limit on purpose. Give them there points back and lets get on with the comp.
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Maverick
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I feel sorry for Oakdale seeing as they have no juniors to bring through the ranks, but the bottom line is that they broke the rules. Every club is aware of the 300 points overall allowed for both sides on the day. If they had a problem getting under the points then they should have approached Group Six and seeked a dispensation as other clubs have done, before the season began, or when they were about to put on players that would put them over the limit.
I watched them play All Saints and they have a very,very good side, but a bystander pointed out to me, 5 current or recent West's State Cup players. If that is true and I cant be 100% sure ( maybe someone from Oakdale can confirm or deny this ) This would mean 200 points in just those players which would make it hard to get the other 30 odd players under 100 points.
I wish Oakdale the very best and I am sure they will still make the semi's.
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tc6_11
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I think the bystander meant 5 wests players for All Saints, not Oakdale. you are ill informed about the entire situation and you should not be commenting on it, this is what will hurt Oakdale, by people getting the wrong message across. Oakdale asked for dispensation, Oakdale have always had dispensation and Oakdale made the group aware about being over the points, but nothing was done about it. Oakdale signed up 3 young boys from Picton and 1 older player from thirlmere to play in their reserve grade side, this was all done in January, the points system was not finalised until mid to late February, with final confirmation being handed down, when the handbooks were given out on the Friday before the first competiiton game. How is this fair?
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galahs
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its good to hear both sides of the story.
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disco stu
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Oakdale only have one former wests state cup player being Leon Keir, 5 is a bit far fetched.
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AllSaints
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GROUP 6/WESTS - Round 6 Results from Waminda

First Grade
East Campbelltown 40 All Saints 14
Tries: Lance Siataga, Matt Funaki, Mick Rauth. Goal: Peter Cashel.

Reserve Grade
East Campbelltown 60 All Saints 0.

Next Sunday at Hillier Oval, Liverpool

2-30pm First Grade v Narellan Jets

1-00pm Reserve Grade v Narellan Jets


GROUP 6/WESTS - Round 6 Results played at Waminda Oval, Leumeah
First Grade: Easts opened the scoring to lead 6-0. Saints led by forwards Matt Blunden, Henry Faulua and Tim Blunden worked play upfield before quick hands saw powerehouse winger Lance Siataga score in the corner and lock forward Peter "Big Show" Cashels conversion attempt swung wide 6-4. Saints errors proved costly and Easts capitalised to add four tries to lead 28-4. Saints rallied and after good lead up work from livewire halfback "Gorgeous" George Papura and five eigth Anthony "Tubby" Delise, Saints added to their total when bustling second rower Matt Funaki crashed over to score. Cashel converted 28-10. Upon resumption Saints had the better of the play but poor finishing proved costly. Easts steadied and added their sixth try to lead 34-10. Both Siataga and second rower Charbel Rabie busted the Easts defence to set sail on long runs but both proved fruitless. Easts added their seventh try to led 40-10. Saints rounded off the scoring when a chain passing movement saw elusive centre Mick "The Bod" Rauth cross the white stripe, Cashels conversion attempt swung wide 40-14.

Reserve Grade: A somewhat depleted All Saints side were no match for a well drilled Easts team who led 28-0 at the break. Easts powered home in the second stanza to run out 60-0 victors.

2010 Point Scorers

First Grade Tries Goals Points

Mick Rauth 2 - 8

Manuele Pasilio 2 - 8

Peter Cashel 1 2 8

Anthony Delise 1 - 4

Carl Partridge 1 - 4

Lance Siataga 1 - 4

Matt Funaki 1 - 4

Reserve Grade Tries Goals Points

Warrick Wood 1 15 34

Sone Key 3 - 12

James Hughes 2 2 12

George Papura 2 - 8

Michael Colin-Thome 2 - 8

William Kawana 2 - 8

Matt Funaki 2 - 8

Anthony Kawana 1 1 6

Ryan Brown 1 - 4

Daniel Todd 1 - 4

Matt Hanna 1 - 4

Phillip Holloway 1 - 4

Lance Siataga 1 - 4

Carl Partridge 1 - 4

Chris Hemsworth 1 - 4

Chris Baliotis 1 - 4
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Blue Devil
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It's disgusting in what has happened to Oakdale, like other teams/clubs in the competition, if you stand up to what you beleive in you will be punished for it, the point system, though it is needed has so many faults and needs to be addressed, how a NRL, premier league and Bundy cup player all be on the same points, a reserve grade player from another club ends up being a 25 point player, this leaves players out of the game, a good example is a young man that loves his footy from Eagle Vale would not get given a chance because his a 25 point player and know may head to Rugby to play a game in the area, I feel for what had happened to Oakdale and hope the combined committee dont go out to get other clubs they don't like! Wouldn't hold my breath, and that's just an opinion
Edited by Blue Devil, May 2 2010, 10:20 PM.
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